How inherently awful was X Factor in retrospect?

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In light of the Liam Payne thread, and everything that has happened since its downfall.

Was it an exceptionally horrible show ethically, or just par for the course in 2000s reality TV?
 
Both. If you watch things like X Factor or The Weakest Link or many comedies, being horrible to and about people was de riguer in the late 90s, early 00s and into the early 10s.
 
From the get go. Exploitative TV at its "finest".

Sharon eviscerating Steve, Ablisa, Jedward/Rylan/Frankie Cocozza/Johnny all being made hate figures and countless people auditioning for the lols. I'm sure there's loads more examples but those are the only ones I can think of off the top of my head.
 
It also helped people live their dream and forge major careers in the music industry who are living the dream.
 
It chewed up and spat out a lot more people than it 'helped'.

I remember the exact moment I fell out with X Factor - I used to enjoy watching the auditions but they had a chap who believed he was receiving messages from John Lennon and that Lennon was recording his voice on his songs. He was an older gentlemen, he seemed entirely serious and it just clicked with me that they were mocking the afflicted. He'd been brought on because of how funny the production team thought it was. After that, I just couldn't watch it at all.
 
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I think there's something too about the age of contestants, which reduced to 14 at one point and then 12 in the USA.

Then the elimination format combined with the sheer length of time they were on, and also the nature of the show leaning on heroes and villains, catastrophe, crying, critical judging, catering to the tabloids, vs shows like Strictly and even BGT, which obviously capture those elements partly but never did to the same degree.
 
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octophone said:
It chewed up and spat out a lot more people than it 'helped'.
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Regardless there are 2 sides to every coin. What happened to Liam Payne is horrendous and I am not saying the programme was not partly at fault but One Direction have another 4 members one of which is probably the biggest star on the planet at the moment.
 
octophone said:
It chewed up and spat out a lot more people than it 'helped'.

I remember the exact moment I fell out with X Factor - I used to enjoy watching the auditions but they had a chap who believed he was receiving messages from John Lennon and that Lennon was recording his voice on his songs. He was an older gentlemen, he seemed entirely serious and it just clicked with me that they were mocking the afflicted. He'd been brought on because of how funny the production team thought it was. After that, I just couldn't watch it at all.
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Exactly the same. They brought out someone and played "country bumpkin" music, he clearly had some kind of disability, and he was basically saying how everyone told him he could sing and he was a star before he got thrown into the audition just for them to laugh at him. It was hideous. Never again.
 
Rita said:
Regardless there are 2 sides to every coin. What happened to Liam Payne is horrendous and I am not saying the programme was not partly at fault but One Direction have another 4 members one of which is probably the biggest star on the planet at the moment.
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But in fairness, that's just about his fame, not his mental health.

Answer the phone
Harry, you're no good alone
Why are you sitting at home on the loor?
What kind of pills are you on?
Ringing the bell
And nobody's coming to help
Your daddy lives by himself
He just wants to know that you're well
 
X Factor gave all of them a huge platform that none of them would have had without it, and it's very likely that none of the acts would have had any success without it.

But the ends doesn't justify the means. Even more so when the means ultimately didn't care the ends.
 
Sheena said:
But in fairness, that's just about his fame, not his mental health.

Answer the phone
Harry, you're no good alone
Why are you sitting at home on the loor?
What kind of pills are you on?
Ringing the bell
And nobody's coming to help
Your daddy lives by himself
He just wants to know that you're well
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I remember when Harry first started with 1D he had to get a lot of coaching and counselling because he got such awful stage fright and couldn’t speak in interviews. They seemed to mould him in to the pop star and person he wanted to become.
 
Oh of course it was dreadful but lest we forget, if it hadn't existed we'd have never got THIS :disco:

 
lolly said:
X Factor gave all of them a huge platform that none of them would have had without it, and it's very likely that none of the acts would have had any success without it.

But the ends doesn't justify the means. Even more so when the means ultimately didn't care the ends.
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Is it still X Factors fault at this stage? He hasn’t been part of One Direction for quite a few years now so I am not sure if they are still connected to X Factor or Simon Cowell now?
 
Rita said:
Is it still X Factors fault at this stage? He hasn’t been part of One Direction for quite a few years now so I am not sure if they are still connected to X Factor or Simon Cowell now?
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I'm not sure if 'fault' is the right word to use, but I do think looking at how people who went through the process of it dealt with it and the ramifications of it, just so hopefully it isn't repeated. Because that sort of show or something similar will come into vogue again. And I wouldn't bank on things being any better.
 
The idea of a television talent show was nothing new, what was new was having people on television who were absolute crap and didn;t know it. New Faces and Opportunity Knocks created some stars too but what they didn't do was set people up for mockery. As much as Jedward have owned it and maintained something, they were essentially the butt of a joke.
 
lolly said:
I'm not sure if 'fault' is the right word to use, but I do think looking at how people who went through the process of it dealt with it and the ramifications of it, just so hopefully it isn't repeated. Because that sort of show or something similar will come into vogue again. And I wouldn't bank on things being any better.
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I do agree to an extent but am not sure how if people ever did want to be part of process in the future that they can do anything much different? Mental health tests before taking part possibly? Even then I am not sure if that would prepare you for these levels of fame. It’s a double edged sword as a lot of people still have major careers from the show that wouldn’t have had any form of career without it. Are they happy? We don’t know I suppose. 🤷‍♀️
 
octophone said:
The idea of a television talent show was nothing new, what was new was having people on television who were absolute crap and didn;t know it. New Faces and Opportunity Knocks created some stars too but what they didn't do was set people up for mockery. As much as Jedward have owned it and maintained something, they were essentially the butt of a joke.
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I knew a lot of people that watched The X Factor auditions for the “silly auditions” and turned off when it was just the talented ones left. This I think is the reason that they let people like Chico/Rylan/Wagner get to the final stages.
 
I know on American Idol, the show really gained its traction with the “awful auditions” and that’s all that mattered until the live shows from like season 2 onward. At first it was fun to see people being silly and as it wore on it just became pure bullying on the producer and hosts part. I haven’t watched in years so I don’t know if that’s still the case but hopefully not.
 
Joseph said:
I know on American Idol, the show really gained its traction with the “awful auditions” and that’s all that mattered until the live shows from like season 2 onward. At first it was fun to see people being silly and as it wore on it just became pure bullying on the producer and hosts part. I haven’t watched in years so I don’t know if that’s still the case but hopefully not.
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Yes, I forgot American Idol was very similar. I have watched on Netflix over the past few years but not until the live shows. Unfortunately that is what the majority of the great unwashed want to watch, or at least did want to watch when X Factor was shown.
 
Sheena said:
Exactly the same. They brought out someone and played "country bumpkin" music, he clearly had some kind of disability, and he was basically saying how everyone told him he could sing and he was a star before he got thrown into the audition just for them to laugh at him. It was hideous. Never again.
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That everyone also being the producers of the show at the actual proper auditions before it’s filmed.
 
Rita said:
I remember when Harry first started with 1D he had to get a lot of coaching and counselling because he got such awful stage fright and couldn’t speak in interviews. They seemed to mould him in to the pop star and person he wanted to become.
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REET, you do realise this is all fictionalised, over produced TV, RIGHT? :D
 
octophone said:
The idea of a television talent show was nothing new, what was new was having people on television who were absolute crap and didn;t know it. New Faces and Opportunity Knocks created some stars too but what they didn't do was set people up for mockery. As much as Jedward have owned it and maintained something, they were essentially the butt of a joke.
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Of course, but they were "strong" enough (sorry, I hate that- I can't think of an alternative), educated and savvy enough to be able to do that and exploit the opportunity. For others, that wasn't possible.

I have a LOT of time for Jedward because of what they've gone on to be since and how they've handled/ marketed themselves. Clearly very clever boys who were never on the top tier of the X Factor ladder and so could get away with more and did that to their advantage.
 
Rita said:
Was it not HIM that said that years later?
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But it follows a very well trodden narrative. "IT SAVED ME!". It's a great story. In the same way Gareth Gates supposedly loved singing because it was the only way he didn''t stutter according to the X Factor and the press at the time. Again, it creates a great story.
 
Sheena said:
But it follows a very well trodden narrative. "IT SAVED ME!". It's a great story. In the same way Gareth Gates supposedly loved singing because it was the only way he didn''t stutter according to the X Factor and the press at the time. Again, it creates a great story.
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Yes, but I don’t see why he would have to mention it himself?
 
Let's not forget this absolutely ghastly moment from X-Factor USA which was probably the ultimate low point.



And whilst Rachel hasn't achieved any level of fame like Liam had, it still fed rather grubby to watch 12 years on.
 
Not sure why but the mood/vibe towards this woman was so weird and it was tense whenever she performed. I gay gasp'd when her new hair was revealed with the most ironic and desperate of song choices. It really felt like all the attention and media was sending her to the VERGE
 
Katie Waissel's pixie cut sending her home was truly a preview of Katy Perry's Witness era while we were all still bopping to California Gurls. simpler times.
 
Rita said:
Yes, but I don’t see why he would have to mention it himself?
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But ask yourself the opposite. Why wouldn't he? It's a nice bit of PR.

I'm not saying his particular case is true or not, I know nothing about it, but it feels naive to just think because a celebrity who is part of that wheel says something positive that it's instantly true.
 
Probably both, it does relates back to the time and standard of reality TV and gameshows, like the point about The Weakest Link haha.
Those shows were kind of childhood nostalgia for me 😅 but I forgot the more specific mean things, or didn't understand at the time.

I guess the demand for young people to become 'superstars' through competitions has been around for centuries. Probably more televised since the 1950s and 60s, where some'd probably be taken advantage of quite easily by companies, bigger fanbases, etc.. Regarding the style and beauty standards in the 90s and 00s, the ideal seemed more limited, and quite discriminatory towards people who didn't fit in, or at least the height of it. :(

Although music-related shows today are generally more considerate, I still think with these mainstream junior talent shows (even Junior Eurovision) that some could be pushing young people towards a certain image/presentation too much. 💡

With social media, those who used these frequently in childhood tend to be more prone to certain societal pressures. I avoided my involvement in a lot, partly due to choice, and because one of my friends got into trouble with Instagram posting in primary school about 10 years ago, not even teenagers at the time.

Overall, the X Factor thing impacted several contestants, it sort of enhanced the problems of the time with image and pressure from TV 'authority' and peers, and of course, each person's approach to and tolerance of that may vary, especially when self-destructive habits are involved. 💭
 
Retrospectively it's super cringey. From very early on I despised the early weeks, where they exploited care in the community for laughs and ad revenue.

In my lifetime there's never been a big Saturday night show that's quite so sensational. With what we know now, a lot of people had to go under the bus to make it is so stand out and exciting. In the 00s, high stakes drama and trauma was the order of the day. What was acceptable has changed a lot.

I'd say X-Factor is as guilty as multiple shows from that time. The decade is increasingly giving off a really nasty vibe, the further we pull away from it. The complete and utter capitalisation of the human soul.

Sure there were multiple amazing performances, moments and characters, but I don't really have much nostalgia for the institution as a whole. It doesn't fill a warm place in my heart, it was too cynical and brash to be charming.

File it with Jade Goody, the economic crash and Bin Laden as emblems of a decade that lost decency, class and stability and swept us all up with it.
 
I think “celebrity” lost its shine for me when I finally saw Madonna up close and personal on the Rebel Heart Tour. I had the realization “oh she’s just a woman up there sweating and doing her best”. I mean I still YAS QUEEN as much as possible but I have tried to be less of a dick about celebs (except Katy Perry) because at the end of the day they are “just like us” only they aren’t allowed the luxury of a real life. The money is amazing but the older I get the more I realize so many of my faves had money and it still didn’t save them in the end (Whitney, George, Amy, etc).
 
I also think shows like Big Brother and Love Island have had their day.
 
This sounds a bit overblown, but looking back at the X-Factor, I feel it presaged the rise of peak mean, Tory, punch-down Britain, which obviously culminated in the socio-political and economic disaster that was the ensuing decade. That being said, it probably all started with Big Brother, when the duality of the glorification / vilification of the mean and / or stupid fully mainstreamed.
 
Loufoque said:
This sounds a bit overblown, but looking back at the X-Factor, I feel it presaged the rise of peak mean, Tory, punch-down Britain, which obviously culminated in the socio-political and economic disaster that was the ensuing decade. That being said, it probably all started with Big Brother, when the duality of the glorification / vilification of the mean and / or stupid fully mainstreamed.
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Really delivering us peak "SOME OF US just LIKE TO READ" Gaga here :disco:
 
Wasn’t sure where to put this. Myleene Klass was just on the tv talking about her time in Hearsay and in the music industry and she said that they all got given a suitcase and sent to the “gifting room” to help themselves to anything they wanted. She said the room was like Ali Babas cave with all the expensive items they could help themselves to. She said it was filled with A list stars with suitcases filling up with all the expensive items. I had never heard of such a thing! How difficult must it be to get treated like this to having nothing.
 
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