The UK: The Andy Burnham years (2 Viewers)

since when are we all entitled to know how every last policy will be funded, however minor? are we (the GP) all economists now? is this not a moving of the goalposts to try and trip up a new PM?
 
Jark said:
since when are we all entitled to know how every last policy will be funded, however minor? are we (the GP) all economists now? is this not a moving of the goalposts to try and trip up a new PM?
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I think it's since Liz spooked the markets by announcing tax cuts and not saying where the money was coming from. But got a long time politicians have spoken about "fully costed" policies.

I think the problem then is that if you DO say where the funding is coming from, it should probably be somewhere where funds have been allocated
 
Andy Burnham has backed away from a multibillion-pound move to increase the personal income tax allowance, as he told his first cabinet meeting: “We’ve got to show fiscal discipline.”

The new UK prime minister had explored the feasibility of declaring an end to the five-year freeze of the £12,570 personal allowance, which he said was “a growing issue” for voters.

“There is not any commitment to do it,” said one ally of Burnham. “What he was saying is that people are feeling unheard.”
 
The freakout over the temporary reduction in energy VAT feels way overblown. It's estimated to be £850 million of unfunded spending compared to the predicted £1.8b for Digital ID. It's hardly in the realms of Liz Truss's £45 billion tax cuts.

And Darren Jones really should have kept his mouth shut rather than staging a petty intervention on day 1. It doesn't reflect well on him at all.
 
Culling all Starmer's pals was probably a mistake. They are, quite memorably, not opposed to sabotaging their own side when they don't get their way.
 
win_the_game said:
The freakout over the temporary reduction in energy VAT feels way overblown. It's estimated to be £850 million of unfunded spending compared to the predicted £1.8b for Digital ID. It's hardly in the realms of Liz Truss's £45 billion tax cuts.

And Darren Jones really should have kept his mouth shut rather than staging a petty intervention on day 1. It doesn't reflect well on him at all.
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Well yes, on both counts. But The Daily Mail today was having a hissy fit about everything and everyone to do with the new Cabinet and its policy announcements - I wouldn’t expect them to show anything but hysteria at this point. I just hope Burnham completely ignores them.

And Darren Jones just shows by his actions that he is immature and no great loss.
 
win_the_game said:
The freakout over the temporary reduction in energy VAT feels way overblown. It's estimated to be £850 million of unfunded spending compared to the predicted £1.8b for Digital ID. It's hardly in the realms of Liz Truss's £45 billion tax cuts.

And Darren Jones really should have kept his mouth shut rather than staging a petty intervention on day 1. It doesn't reflect well on him at all.
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Darren Jones is a cunt. this is the problem with Labour - there are just so many people in it for the wrong reasons who would rather cut off the party's legs than let somebody from a "rival faction" get on with it for a bit.

vote green!
 
THe Right are going to lose their MINDS - they just spent 15+ years convincing everyone you have to cut everything constantly and Burnham is very clearly going Trad Labour - its like watching people come blinking into the light - like its actually supposed to when you get a Labour government and you wake up with the sense their are people working busily away in the background trying to help you rather than fuck you even further. And all because they wouldn't give Starmer a single days rest - they absolutely brought this themselves. And now he is going to be popular and they are going to be fucked.
 
I've been stalking the Facebook comments, and they're mostly positive. These little things early appear to be projecting an air of 'getting stuff done' and in the grand scheme of politics they cost very little.
 
One of the (many) fatal errors Starmer’s Labour made was to open with almost entirely negative activity and messaging. They obviously calculated that with a huge majority and the Tories in tatters, they could afford a bit of negative press, but they completely turned people off by appearing like continuity austerity Tories, which of course got even worse when they got spooked by Reform and tacked even further to the right.

Burnham seems to be taking the opposite approach for now, which is heartening. Although I do wonder how long it’ll last.
 
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VoR said:
One of the (many) fatal errors Starmer’s Labour made was to open with almost entirely negative activity and messaging. They obviously calculated that with a huge majority and the Tories in tatters, they could afford a bit of negative press, but they completely turned people off by appearing like continuity austerity Tories, which of course got even worse when they got spooked by Reform and tacked even further to the right.

Burnham seems to be taking the opposite approach for now, which is heartening. Although I do wonder how long it’ll last.
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I was just thinking how, in retrospect, Starmer really was terrible. Doom and gloom from day one, no clear 'direction' politically and absolutely dog shit at communicating with the public.
 
Iguana said:
I think it's since Liz spooked the markets by announcing tax cuts and not saying where the money was coming from. But got a long time politicians have spoken about "fully costed" policies.

I think the problem then is that if you DO say where the funding is coming from, it should probably be somewhere where funds have been allocated
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Well yes, but Liz Truss's unfunded tax cuts move was to the tune of £45bn (and at a proper budget style event) compared to £700m for this (as an announcement rather than at a budget) :D
 
win_the_game said:
The freakout over the temporary reduction in energy VAT feels way overblown. It's estimated to be £850 million of unfunded spending compared to the predicted £1.8b for Digital ID. It's hardly in the realms of Liz Truss's £45 billion tax cuts.

And Darren Jones really should have kept his mouth shut rather than staging a petty intervention on day 1. It doesn't reflect well on him at all.
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Oh, WTG already said that :disco:
 
big ron said:
I was just thinking how, in retrospect, Starmer really was terrible. Doom and gloom from day one, no clear 'direction' politically and absolutely dog shit at communicating with the public.
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If Burnham learns one thing from Starmer it should be to stop trying to appease people who will never vote for you. The right wing press are literally getting a race war on the go, nothing will make these people endorse Labour so do the stuff they hate anyway. If the people feel better off in 3 years time, Labour will win the next election, assuming Reform's implosion.
 
octophone said:
If Burnham learns one thing from Starmer it should be to stop trying to appease people who will never vote for you. The right wing press are literally getting a race war on the go, nothing will make these people endorse Labour so do the stuff they hate anyway. If the people feel better off in 3 years time, Labour will win the next election, assuming Reform's implosion.
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The more he tried to appease them, the more they hated him!
 
big ron said:
The more he tried to appease them, the more they hated him!
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...at the cost of core support. We watched Labour's polling crash during the election campaign from the high 40s to the mid 30s and it was an absolute failure of basic logic that led them to conclude that they lost those votes to Reform because they absolutely didn't. Maybe a scattering where people were prepared to vote Labour as a last resort and rejoiced at having an alterative right wing party instead but nowhere near the extent that Starmer and his goons supposed.
 
"Blimey the Lib Dems and the Greens did a lot better than anyone expected? I wonder where they got those votes from? Can't have been us, after all, we spouted a load of anti-immigration and transphobic bilge to the papers, why would anyone choose not to vote for us after all THAT?..."
 
I have a theory that Britain never really got over the Civil War. What people really want is a Cavalier (I mean in style and tone not religion or views on monarchy). Johnson, Burnham, Blair are Cavaliers. Occasionally there's a lurch to Roundheads like May, Truss, Starmer where people think they want a harsh responsible parent but they soon tire of them and reject them harshly. When Cavaliers fuck up it's their own doing e.g. Covid parties, Iraq. The only one I can't make quite fit this is Thatcher who was sort of both
 
Nobody really commenting on the fact that Reform lost no support after the weeks of Farage getting destroyed over his bungs.

A third of this electorate really do think he’s the best person for the job, whether he’s a crook or not. That’s Trump territory.
 
funky said:
Nobody really commenting on the fact that Reform lost no support after the weeks of Farage getting destroyed over his bungs.

A third of this electorate really do think he’s the best person for the job, whether he’s a crook or not. That’s Trump territory.
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Ann Widdecombe dead effect?
 
SvalaWuzRobbed said:
I have a theory that Britain never really got over the Civil War. What people really want is a Cavalier (I mean in style and tone not religion or views on monarchy). Johnson, Burnham, Blair are Cavaliers. Occasionally there's a lurch to Roundheads like May, Truss, Starmer where people think they want a harsh responsible parent but they soon tire of them and reject them harshly. When Cavaliers fuck up it's their own doing e.g. Covid parties, Iraq. The only one I can't make quite fit this is Thatcher who was sort of both
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:D
 
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funky said:
Nobody really commenting on the fact that Reform lost no support after the weeks of Farage getting destroyed over his bungs.

A third of this electorate really do think he’s the best person for the job, whether he’s a crook or not. That’s Trump territory.
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I have no expecations anymore when it comes to politics anymore but it would not suprise me at all(at the current rate of scandal) if he buggers off before the next GE.

He's clearly absolutely hating being subject to the tiniest bit of scrutiny and cannot handle it
 
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funky said:
Nobody really commenting on the fact that Reform lost no support after the weeks of Farage getting destroyed over his bungs.

A third of this electorate really do think he’s the best person for the job, whether he’s a crook or not. That’s Trump territory.
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They are broadly losing support in other polls. 28% is one of the best results of any pollster for them - and they don't really seem to be topping 30% much anymore at the minute. But then, that's also pretty similar across a lot of developed Western countries (the US a notable exception) in terms of the level of support the radical right parties can broadly count on. About a quarter of the public is pretty racist, and the shame around being open about it has just gone.
 
They are fucked because there is no natural rightwing majority in this country - but just usually a really undisciplined gaggle of factionalised centre left parties manage to fumble the ball - but that appears to be changing - not because the left have got their shit together - but because the rightwing are starting to really splinter in a way that is genuinely damaging to them based on the electoral system we have for GEs.
 
www.theguardian.com

Business rates cut for pubs, clubs and music venues in England only ‘a small move’, say critics

Hospitality businesses call on Andy Burnham to cut VAT and extend help to hotels and restaurants
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
Pubs, clubs and live music venues in England will receive a 20% cut to their business rates bills from next April under a plan from Andy Burnham to support local high streets, in his latest measure to tackle costs for working people and communities.

The prime minister said the £100m package would be fully funded including through reviewing reliefs for businesses that do not make a positive contribution to communities, such as vape shops. The business rates cut will benefit nearly 32,000 pubs, clubs and live music venues, according to the government, saving the typical pub an estimated £1,100 in the next financial year. The support will be targeted so that the very largest live music venues are not included.
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yes! throw the vape shops under the bus! :disco:
 
Jark said:
I don't get it - what is the tweet trying to disprove?
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it's just flailing arms at this point - determined to find any kind of weak arsed gotcha because these people don't really want anything to get better, they are too invested in talking everything down and being angry. Fuck them, with a side of toast.
 
Jark said:
I don't get it - what is the tweet trying to disprove?
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I think the implication here is that he's being inauthentic filming social first content when he has a camera man with him who could be shooting professional looking content fit for a Prime Minister.

Which is ludicrous. Meet people where they are, in the format they expect!
 
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