Taylor Swift - The Life of a Showgirl (12th album)

VoR said:
www.theguardian.com

Taylor Swift’s Charli xcx hit job misses the point – and underscores her tedious obsession with conflict | Laura Snapes

Sixteen months after Charli used Brat to air her anxieties about Swift, the US star’s graceless response is a missed opportunity for growth – and betrays her vengeful side
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

The think pieces on this album are going to be everywhere, but the comparison here between how Lorde and Taylor reacted to being called out by Charli is pretty damning.
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Is it not also interesting that there's clearly an editorial "get her" going on with the Guardian, from both the review and the think piece coming out simultaneously and referencing each other?
 
Sheena said:
It's certainly not worthy of the "ABSOLUTELY APPALLING" cries that have gone out here so far.
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or maybe it is! you can't honestly say her songwriting is on the level that it was before. she's phoning it in.
 
Jark said:
or maybe it is! you can't honestly say her songwriting is on the level that it was before. she's phoning it in.
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Is "phoning it in" (even if I agreed with that) the same as "absolutely appalling", though? It's over the top hyperbole...
 
I gave it a curiosity listen and found it to be fine but unremarkable. Wood was my standout despite the icky lyrics and there were some other nice moments here and there but she’s not for me and I shan’t be listening again.

Back to Here For It All I go!
 
Sheena said:
Is it not also interesting that there's clearly an editorial "get her" going on with the Guardian, from both the review and the think piece coming out simultaneously and referencing each other?
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That’s all a bit ’drag race villain blames the edit’ though, isn’t it?

Even if the Guardian is exploiting Taylor making a bad album for clickbait (duh!), the lyrics she wrote are still the lyrics she wrote.
 
VoR said:
That’s all a bit ’drag race villain blames the edit’ though, isn’t it?

Even if the Guardian is exploiting Taylor making a bad album for clickbait (duh!), the lyrics she wrote are still the lyrics she wrote.
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Oh absolutely, but, equally, I'm not entirely sure that correlates with their opinion being "damning"...

But she's always done this shit, which, admittedly, the article references. It's not any different to Reputation, You Need To Calm Down etc....
 
it's about time we called Taylor out on her habit of punching down especially on other women in the industry. pulling shenanigans to block Billie and Charli getting their #1 albums was a dire move. her charli diss track is revenging something that didn't happen.
 
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Jark said:
it's about time we called Taylor out on her habit of punching down especially on other women in the industry. pulling shenanigans to block Billie and Charli getting their #1 albums was a dire move. her charli diss track is revenging something that didn't happen.
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Oh call her out for the first bit and the multiformatting SHIT absolutely, but how do we know it's "something that didn't happen"?

WE WEREN'T THERE! :D
 
Honey just came up on my 2nd listen.

I change my initial score to 0/10.

This song is dreadful.
 
Sadly it is giving

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rather than

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at this point after one listen, but WE’LL SEE
 
Sheena said:
Also, why have I become a Taylor Swift apologist? I like her but I'm not exactly a STAN.

I TRULY AGREE I AM JUST BEING CONTRARY.
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NEVER CHANGE DARLING

We always need DISSENTING VOICES

Speaking of - I DO wonder sometimes what our SHIRL makes of Swift? @Shirley
 
Sheena said:
But then that's perhaps her own fault for promising us an album of bangers...which this absolutely is not.
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Precisely. It feels like expectation mismanagement after multiple things about this signalled big pop album.
 
OK, second listen over and I have decided that the title track is probably the best thing on it along with Ophelia. Good bookends. The rest can all go.
 
In all seriousness though I think the hate she's getting for a Charli 'diss' track is ludicrous.
'Diss tracks' have been going forever.. and I don't just mean Drake vs Kendrick Lamar or 2Pac vs BIG etc. etc. in the '90s but also historically between poets and writers!
So for two women to have diss tracks against each other in the pop sphere in 2024-2025 should really be nothing new.
And may I add - the response to Taylor's diss track (whichever side one may be on) is a little bit on the sexist side. You feeling me, The so-called 'Guardian'?
 
Suedehead said:
So for two women to have diss tracks against each other in the pop sphere in 2024-2025 should really be nothing new.
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The point is that Sympathy is a Knife is not a diss track though! Taylor has taken a song about the internal anxieties Charli was feeling about being around Taylor, and Taylor used it as an excuse to shit all over Charli (with an absolutely terrible song)
 
Jark said:
it's about time we called Taylor out on her habit of punching down especially on other women in the industry. pulling shenanigans to block Billie and Charli getting their #1 albums was a dire move. her charli diss track is revenging something that didn't happen.
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She didn't pull shenanigans to block Billie and Charli, she pulled shenanigans to stay at #1. It was of no relevance whatsoever to her who those albums were by. That is also a problem but it's a different problem.
 
I don't get sexism from Laura Snapes' article. Two of the biggest female artists in the world have written songs about eachother - of course people are going to compare them - and I think she's done it in a way that looks at the nuances of what makes Charli's interesting, and why Taylor's feels LAME in response.
 
GNL said:
I don't get sexism from Laura Snapes' article.
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Well I did.
The whole article reeks of her basically saying there is a right way for a woman to diss another woman and a wrong way.
We should be beyond this sort of narrative and framing of women in pop music in 2025.
At least I would've thought The Guardian should be. Instead, they seem to be obsessed with getting likes in Comments sections... which ironically is something that Taylor Swift references on her new album.
 
ZenGiraffe said:
The point is that Sympathy is a Knife is not a diss track though!
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ding ding. Taylor doesn't have the emotional nuance to write such songs about women, only about men (sometimes). it's worth saying and the article is bang on. it's not in any way a sexist piece, quite the opposite.
 
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Also, this casting of Charli as some sweet innocent little pop girle is hilarious. She gives PLENTY out, she can take a bit too.

If I was only allowed Taylor's catalogue or Charli's catalogue, it's no contest and Charli wins by a continent but, please, let's not pretend that she's been a sweetheart to everyone along the way.
 
Sympathy is a Knife may not be a "diss track" in the conventional sense but it's still a pointed song that references Taylor Swift. She's free to respond in whichever way she wants. For anyone to say she can't or shouldn't respond in a certain way is... problematic.
 
Suedehead said:
NEVER CHANGE DARLING

We always need DISSENTING VOICES
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I do agree with Jark's comment about beating down, fair point, but also, I fail to see what there is to really hate about Swiftie apart from her being massive. We're just tearing down successful females again.

I don't see a male pop star getting this level of scrutiny.
 
octophone said:
She didn't pull shenanigans to block Billie and Charli, she pulled shenanigans to stay at #1. It was of no relevance whatsoever to her who those albums were by. That is also a problem but it's a different problem.
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But, you see, it feeds the "TAYLOR SWIFT HATES OTHER WOMEN!!!!!" narrative to say that she releases variants and times them to block her contemporaries, so why argue against it?
 
There is no one as OMNIPRESENT as Swift, whether you like her or not.

Blocking the forum only works so far, but when she sneezes she GETS A BREAKING NEWS NOTIFICATION.

No escape and she doesn't even like you.
 
ZenGiraffe said:
It is a song that we listeners are also free to critique though, and I haven't seen any criticism that is invalid or to my mind sexist.
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Criticism is fine, but my point is that framing it within the 'Taylor Swift hates other women' context that seems to be pervasive in this thread is problematic.
 
And why is this thread not live yet?
The things I do for Moopy to get post counts up. Honestly!


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